It feels sensational. But for my character, its different. And I say, Well, Taylor wouldnt say policemen, they would say cop' or some gender neutral version of whatever the word is. In 2020 alone it has been reported that at least 40 transgender people have been murdered, the majority of which were Black and Latinx trans women. The truth is, despite feeling profoundly happy right now and knowing how much privilege I carry, I am also scared. I dont know if that answers your question. ", "Finally undergoing bottom surgery has allowed me to confidently flourish in my new body and dismantle any remaining gender dysphoria. Sun: Absolutely. "Billions" star Asia Kate Dillon, the first gender nonbinary performer to play a nonbinary character on a major TV show, made headlines in 2017 when they asked the TV Academy to clarify its . I really like a structure. Dillon, who gave eye-catching performances as Lucifer off-off-Broadway and as a white supremacist on Orange Is the New Black, broke out as Taylor Mason, a nonbinary hedge fund wunderkind on the Showtime series Billions., Hello, Im Taylor, the character says when first meeting the funds boss, Bobby Axelrod (Damian Lewis). Asia, thank you for letting me indulge my inner fan for so long. In animation, because it doesnt have to ascribe to the physical realism that exists in live-action film and TV, you can be super expressive, they say, pointing to Cartoon Networks Adventure Time among other recent examples. Adult animation has had gay, trans, non-binary characters. How was that? Sun: It was really enjoyable. They essentially do the thing that we often see men, male heroes, in cartoons do. Dillon: Thank you again for asking about it and letting me talk about it. Taylors everything is very well manicured and particular. I think that thats one of those things where when you are describing it to that extent, I think it indicates that youre really thinking about the intention of why youre taking on something and or why youre not. This is why, when we were talking about the history of pioneering representations of inclusion, a lot of times it starts with sci-fi or it has started with genre. Below, some highlights from our quick but deep conversation. And I was thinking that Taylor can be held up in many ways as a universal example of that positive representation not just for non-binary identity, but for so many of the characters on Billions, I feel like the writers have done a great job of making them authentically and organically the identity that they have, whether its racial or gender or different ways, but its never the focus of what their storyline or what their character is all about. Theres a tiny little calculator known as BMO who is genderless, because why wouldnt a tiny little calculator be genderless? For those who arent already familiar with this argument, I almost want to save time and just tell them to Google it. So our last two questions that I ask every podcast guest, Im going to give them both to you, because Ive realized that people get really confused when I only ask the first one. You know its interesting that people think that pants are masculine. Obviously sci-fi is the place where you can explore, but when its the only place that you explore gender outside of cisgender identity, you literally dehumanize it.. At the beginning of this season, Taylor shows up in female drag. Theres still not enough, so lets keep going. A now confident, quick-witted CEO outsmarted many. Sun: How intentional I mean, its probably safe to assume that Looney Tunes, Chuck Jones and those creators werent necessarily conscious or fully cognizant of that but these latter-day animators, this current generation you mentioned Adventure Time. I think there are a lot of valid criticisms of that character and what it laid the groundwork for and how it embodied a lot of harmful treatment of gender and non-binary identities in Hollywood. Do you think its useful in times like this, or does it just serve to make bad people more palatable?Youve kind of hit on what the issue can be. Keanu Reeves had the idea for a character who wasnt going to take up physical arms in this movie, who had a different kind of power, a quiet power. But how about this: Because I know that your position has modified or evolved somewhat from 2017 and 2018, when you received back-to-back nominations for best supporting actor at Critics Choice Awards, and the Emmys allowed you to submit in the supporting actor category, and that was something that you did at the time where are you right now in terms of how you feel about this whole situation, this whole issue? And so now, having the opportunity to talk about it and have it printed is extraordinary for me, and it doesnt get tiring., One particularly notable moment of explanation was when Dillon was a guest on The Ellen DeGeneres Show. To me, thats a great compliment if they didnt know that the actor playing Taylor is the same actor that plays Brandy on Orange. So thats GLAADs poll, and also people saw the movie and tweeted at me or messaged me and said, like, I cant believe theres a non-binary character in this movie. I mean, every press release that came out about the movie where I was talking about it, I was very upfront: This character is non-binary, it wasnt written that way, the studio and Chad Stahelski and Keanu, they loved it. I got to speak to NPR about it, and Ill just repeat something that I said there, which is like, Okay, so then if Denzel Washington can enter as an actress and Viola Davis can enter as an actor, then the Emmys themselves have shown the categories to be absurd and archaic and ultimately meaningless. Its about making space for everyone. So, Abbey, thank you for helping expand my understanding of this. And its past time. You made yourself a burger? And I think our media is really representative of how that conversation has changed. And I applaud the Gotham Awards for abolishing their gendered acting categories. And the categories existing within the context of the awards show are exclusionary and it is erasure of anyone who exists outside of the gender binary. Im curious, though, whether or not we will see a trickle-down effect to non-binary performers getting to play non-binary characters or whether their roles will be along binary lines. I think, Actually, I do need to take this opportunity to engage in this conversation, because there is perhaps a bridge to understanding here that will benefit people who dont have a voice, who cant walk down the street without being told to kill themselves.. Asia Kate Dillon on Being Non-Binary Slaven Vlasic/Getty "Non-binary is a term used by some people, myself included, who experience their gender identity as falling somewhere outside the. 454 1. Dillon: I will play whatever part I am the right actor for. White: Yes, exactly. And while their portrayals may or may not have always been respectful, intentional, progressive, I think that this idea that we do not always live within two spaces on a gender line has been persistent. Taylor has moved around a lot across the seasons, but for the purposes of this general podcast I will have to restrain myself. I was just thinking about Alec Baldwin because hes on the current cover of The Atlantic, and I was just thinking that we have to be able to laugh at someone like 45. What else are you up to?My partner and I co-founded a production company together. Im remembering one of the earliest interviews you gave, I think it was on the Ellen show where you delineated the difference between the physiology of our bodies and I think what you called gender identity being what is between the ears. Something that is more about I dont want to put words in your mouth but I think more about a consciousness, it seems, rather than a biological expression? ", "[As a model], I definitely don't want to tell trans people that they need to buy things in order to fully come into themselves as a trans person. So now going beyond Billions and talking a little bit more about your whole career as well as the industry, in your experience and to your knowledge, how much opportunity is out there for non-binary or gender fluid or genderqueer actors to be able to also play non-binary characters? There was an episode of The Next Generation where the Enterprise visits a planet where the gender binary is prohibited. Post Malone, Riz Ahmed, Josephine Skriver, and More on the Fly Way to Dress Down This Summer. In the "Beyond the Binary" episode of THR's inclusion-themed podcast, the actor shares how their groundbreaking character helped them understand their own gender identity, and makes the case for gender neutral acting awards categories. ", "I'm not [transitioning] to be interesting. This episode is about non-binary identity. Actor Asia Kate Dillon predicts that widespread scrapping of gendered entertainment categories is just a matter of time. And I think Pat is really, really interesting, particularly for me, because when Pat was popular, I was young. Most casting breakdowns specify male and female roles. It was created by colonists and imposed on the indigenous peoples of the so-called United States of America. I like schedules so that I can just figure out how Im going to bob and weave through it all. Oct 14, 2020. Specifically as it pertains to gender identity. I would like to be, though. Its a challenge and I love a challenge. Some of it feels a little weird. So I do feel left out of conversations that continue to align femininity and womanhood with uteruses and vaginas. That sounds juicy, tell me more about that.Theres a lot of healthy food on both sets, which is really nice. And this is laced in very conscious, purposeful ways throughout the entire series. Asia Kate Dillon: I agree. If it had been that I wouldnt have wanted to do it. "Hi. Does that make sense? White: Its definitely interesting when you start to think about how aggressively gendered our culture is. Billions or Orange Is the New Black?They are literally so different. Dillon: Exactly. Dillon: I have certainly said that very phrase, that whatever hope Taylor gave to other people once Taylor appeared onscreen, Taylor gave me that hope and sense of self first. Dillon is non-binary and uses singular they pronouns. That would mean that those characters are continuing to be written and that they are continuing to be integral to whatever story theyre a part of. Sun: And that really does emerge in so many different topics when weve been talking about inclusion is that these are sandboxes that are in some ways to use this overworn phrase in a genuine way a safe space to be able to explore some of these stories or identities that mainstream culture wasnt ready for yet. Billions and Orange Is The New Black actor Asia Kate Dillon has a neck tattoo that reads, in twirly script, einfhlung. Einfhlung, the German word for empathy, is something Dillon (surprise!) When I got the breakdown, I was like, Oh, right. You're not beautiful despite those things, you're beautiful because of those things, and [believing] that has to be an active conscious process. Im also so thankful to my colleague, THR associate editor Abbey White, for coming on as this weeks guest expert to share what non-binary representation has meant to their own identity formation and to teach me about the genres that perhaps surprisingly have done pretty well with gender non-conforming inclusion. (Laughs.). And that creates a ripple effect for other gender identities. I mean, there are always meals on set. Thousands of new, high-quality pictures added every day. Non-binary people have always existed. And Im certainly happy as a light-skinned white person to play an antihero onscreen, because we have so many examples of white people as heroes. And what does that mean? It gives us a glimpse into why were drawn to people in power who arehahawho they are. And so some folks have gotten the door to be able to play themselves opened sooner. I am actually glad that people try. 55 Non-Binary People Explain What "Non-Binary" Means To Them. And then I dont know exactly when it happened, but I think probably last year, I cant pinpoint it exactly, I really came to an understanding that the choice between actor and actress in the context of award shows where those words only mean man/woman, male/female gender or assigned sex, asking non-binary or intersex or gender nonconforming people to choose between those categories is a false choice. Since then, Ive had all different kinds of styles and colors, and for Orange Is the New Black I played a skinhead, so it worked for that. It feels like it's prone to getting sensationalized. And I think that holds true for the entire Billions world, which is, if whatevers going on with you doesnt in the way of you making money or you making someone else money, then its not really actually a big deal. And it doesnt dictate what my gender identity is. The net worth of Asia Kate Dillon is estimated to be around $4 million while the figure on their annual income/salary is under review. This is reality for us, and all we ask for is acceptance and validation for what we say that we are. Now I have leftovers from last night: a burger, kale with apple cider vinegar. And so it enters this really interesting space where I kind of consider it like American Girl Doll-ing, where youre picking pieces and parts and putting that character together instead of just saying, white male, 30 to 50s, father, something that anybody can slide into. You can watch Asia on Billions, whose fifth season is airing now Sundays at 9 p.m. on Showtime. Asia finished the Meisner training program at The Actors Workshop of Ithaca and was the youngest student to enroll at the age of 16 while they were still in high school. This was such a pleasure. And there is a part of me thats like, Gosh, I wish I know its historically significant and extraordinarily important, and Im really proud of it, and there is something about it that feels a little bit tainted by the fact that GLAAD doesnt qualify it as trans representation. And the problem up until now has been that there has been the majority of one kind of representation. With her . Everyone has a gender identity, actually. White: Yes! But what the 33-year-old gets asked about perhaps most frequently is gender identity: Dillons is nonbinary, with the preferred pronoun of they.. And then for the other half of the race, its reversed. And those personal moments are important. 2023 The Hollywood Reporter, LLC. In one of their interviews, they revealed that they were currently dating a man, however, chose to not divulge any further details such as his name or the duration of their relationship. I think thats honestly one of the most radical things about Ted Lasso. I love wearing wigs. It was most certainly a powerful part of my own journey with my gender, realizing that I did not have to be this thing because of the gender that was assigned to me and all of the baggage that comes with that. GQ Style: Please explain to me what you have brought in your jar. It's something everyone wants, to feel understood. Asia Kate Dillon: When I looked up the word non-binary, it said, "An umbrella term for any number of gender identities falling outside the boxes of man and woman.". But theyre also the first person to be in the room. And I think this applies to lots of marginalized groups, like doing blackface was a big no-no a lot longer than doing cripface. Asia Kate Dillon was born on November 15, 1984 in Ithaca, New York, USA. But I also think that sci-fi and fantasy are about places of imagination and exploration, and in the same way that animation is this place where we do not have to exist within the limits of humanness, its an incredible place to explore lots of things, things that we want to see, things that we want to be. My joy is real, but it is also fragile. Your characters get to do different things and they get to be different people, and thats because theyre not conforming to that binary. White: Thats the weight of the first, right? And obviously this is not an intentional non-binary representation, but . Did the concept of Taylor also being non-binary come from you?No, the character was written as non-binary. Its not really your business, because its not your gender. Asia Kate Dillon was born on November 15, 1984 in Ithaca, New York, USA. But I do think that if I was going to redo one, I would really love to see Pat in 2021, like what would that narrative actually look like? So yes, its going to happen soon. Although as an actor, Im never judging the character that Im playing, because thats not helpful. White: This is really difficult because to have a line of appropriateness, you have to have roles. Back in 2016, fans of the critically acclaimed Netflix dramedy "Orange Is the New Black" were introduced to the character Brandy Epps, a member of the prison's white supremacy gang. the government, the planet, the race forces her to undergo a conversion therapy of sorts to go back to a they, which is really interesting. I feel like a lot of art these days is just entertainment for entertainments sake. Click here for your trial subscription: https:. Knowledge has changed over time. I'm scared of the invasiveness, the hate, the 'jokes' and of violence. My pronouns are they, theirs and them.. Asia Kate Dillon Net Worth. Its amazing how much, while prepping for this episode, I was like, Wow, its really hard to decolonize your brain from the gender binary. There were versions of the script that had pronouns for the Adjudicator that were he/him, there were versions that had she/her. One show that I got hooked on during the pandemic was Good Trouble, which is a follow-up to Freeforms The Fosters. The people that I worked with, they saw that when I got onstage and actually got to live in the clothing that I wanted to be in. GQ may earn a portion of sales from products that are purchased through our site as part of our Affiliate Partnerships with retailers. Theres also a storyline involving a character, Gael. What does it mean for you to fall in love with someone, and they fall in love with you, under the assumption that you are one thing and youre actually the other? We have one character that I really, really love, Bobbie Yang from Rutherford Falls. Abbey White: Yeah, Ive been here for a couple of months and this is our first meeting, so Im very excited about that. I like sphere Ive been using the word spectrum, but I think sphere is even more encompassing of all the different identities that can fall within it. Sun: I will give people a spoiler alert if I go into that. They can be in literally anything. ', 3 dream interpretation tips, from a psychotherapist, Mental health of LGBTQ youth worsening in current 'hostile political climate', Self-care tips for irritable bowel syndrome. My first day on set there was a Red Bull on Taylors desk, and we were like, Taylor wouldnt drink red bull. What I can think of as problematic is when non-binary characters are written and Im not saying Ive seen evidence of this but when non-binary characters are written without anyone consulting a non-binary person, whether it be actors they are considering for the role, but frankly it needs to happen before then.